The Clairvoyant Zoopraxiscope

Nadja by Breton and translated through Howard says "I am the thought on the bath in the room without mirrors." Who do we talk to? We are alive, but see those words outside our self so they may be revisited or reinhabited: Claudia Rankine draws a difference between location and function.
 

Despite qualifying for academic and athletic scholarships in college, to begin with (noting that is other than to brag I was neither the brightest scholar nor strongest athlete)..in order to have enough money to have a social life, during the summers I would work in the maintenance dept. The chore load included hauling radiators, steel bed frames...and simple housekeeping (washing toilets, windows..mopping)..

The job did allow more space to talk to one's co-workers while working, at times (the best part of any job), but it was an exhaustive workload, at other times. I would say, that as human, there was a certain humility to performing said chores that kept one's self, in check with the simple concerns in life.

Since college I have pretty much had one dull day job after another, from video store clerk, to answering the phones in a call center in mid town Manhattan.

The job answering the phones, paid the most, but it was really boring, I couldn't afford a membership to the gym, and really asnwering nearly 100 phone calls a day...and repeating the required text (within the three minute time limit) really left very little space for dreaming, while on the job. On the weekend I would try to dream, but I'd be frazzled..and the poems sounded tense.

After what seemed like a reversal of fortune (though I have yet to make very much money)...I've ended up working in maitenance and grounds keeping again. The job includes painting, cleaning bathrooms, vacumming..basic housekeeping.

The job can be dull and doesn't pay that much-- low enough to where at times simple every day needs buying the groceries can be a little bit of a strain if there are too many other bills due at the same time-- so, one would wish to avoid a inappropriate "romanticizing" of the role. But one can say that as a working, breathing, thinking, eating...dreaming experience..

it is closer to the experience of listening to the cosmic funny music of gilberto gil, the rugged naturalism of a ray acuff..or the thinking/feeling of shuffling one's feet to the american funk cartoon landscape of a song by james brown, than say, flying a plane, or, weirdly enough, mabye listening to somebody else's dreams as a therapist (though one wonders if the experience of listening to the dreams of another, might assist another in the experience of learning "how to dream").

What is it to dream? Do these jobs put one more in touch with the commanality of dreaming?

One can say this, though the tasks at hand, probably require more of an application of the objective faculties of the brain, than arguabley, writing an automatic poem (after all, the standard for the job is, basically, did you apply windex to the defined cubic area, between parameters, in such a way as to actually clean the window? and things like that)...

the job does allow one more space to wander off a bit(mentally) than say, answering the phones...


One can also say this: at the end of a week cleaning toilets and things like that, one feels more like sitting back and daydreaming than cleaning the dishes, right away. One would probably clean the dishes off the second day of the weekend, of course. But say one were to look at the person's sanitation just on that one weekend day where they were chillin'?

Though the person's entire livelood revolved around cleaning an office, and overall, you could say they were every bit as concerned with cleanliness as somebody on a ship or something,
just looking at that moment, it would be a simple enough misunderstanding to think that the said individual didn't wash dishes and was simply concerned with dreaming. Maybe during the week, the person works all of the time.

But on the weekend, not having enough money to go out to a movie or show, the experience of dreaming, and maybe writing a song or something, seems more readily affordable. Of course, they might not have enough money to buy the recording equipment to record the song, or document the dream.
 

maybe..excuse the typos and grammatical errors...

i'm posting from work, on my break...and sort of am between things (i'm saving up for the lap top..but noting that is other than an appeal to pity...though far from the richest kid on the block...i probably did have a nicer ride as a kid..than say someone that worked in a factory..i did bag groceries during the summer in high school..but was lazier then..than i would be today..)..

I'd say that, there are better jobs, with better pay, but as far as the menial end of the american job exprience goes, housekeeping does allow one the opportunity to breath fresh air more often, than recycled air conditioning air. Also, the opportunity for cardio-vascular excercise also keeps one in better shape than the sedentary position of sitting in a cubicle. It is possible that niether job provides the income to join a health club or gym, so at least there's some kind of excercise during the week. If you have a lot of chores on the weekend, also, you might not have enough time to jog, or whatever. So, at least you get some kind of cardio-vascular going during one's chores at work. Physical health, might not lead to one dreaming any more than they would otherwise (if one is the social type prone to "dreaming)...but one might note, that improved physcial health, might assist one with dreaming more clearly.

Noting those things, is other than to feign phsycial strength or show off or anything (i have skinny arms)...

just an honest account of how that themes played out in my own life..

i'd imagine others might have similar experiences (i'm other than one that would think it makes me "special" or anything..i feel fortunate to work at all..with the way the world's going lately...)
 

ah sorry about the anyonymous on the housekeeping...

this is john mark again...(some people think i just sit around and daydream or something..i have a job...)..

i need to just wait for the weekend, when i have more spare time to post..to avoid this garrulous problemo..and lack of brevity...
 

Sometimes, when one observes something ordinary, like the grass on the lawn, the fading afternoon light, they might note to themselves, that, with that elliptical fading quality, the world seems "dream-like", or, you might say, like something somebody or something, had "dreamed up."

At the same time, having worked on the lawn, one is aware of the objective qualities of the world, that grass is something that has to be watered, and that what we do, affect things, everything matters. In that sense, the word "dream" seems inappropriate (as it might imply a lack of consequence). When you think about it though, the objective quality makes it just seem all the more esoteric "dream-like" in some ways. Is that the nature of a dream?

In caring for the grass, you understand that there is life, and that life is something that needs to be maintained. Maybe it's someplace within that, that we begin to respect life. Maybe it's someplace within all of that, that esoteric dream like thing, and understanding that there is..life..
that one begins to have some weird vaugue sense of it all, even as one apprehends the definable particulars, of the cosmic.

Some other examples of it's actual but then it all seems like a dream, that we might note, would probably be things like the way light changes with the passage of time, and the way the leaves look on their branches on the trees, as the daylight flutters all around.

One is tempted to say, that it is when one has understanding of that,
that one begins to understand the differences between, that weird it's actual but it seems like a dream, or like something dreamed though everything really matters and affects things, and we should care, quality of the unfolding of time (though it'd be difficult to say we can know how it all works out or what it all goes to or whatever..)..and the "faux determination" variation of waking dream..uh..for expample..like..when there's an image of somebody in a weird suit on tv and then a week later somebody walks into the room in the same kidn of suit, so it seems like the tv is real, and like you are in a dream. The visceral manipulations of that sort of thing are obvious, and I don't know how to define the difference, but it's different than that weird untethered quality on finds in the passage of time, and the way the breeze goes...

Then again, one can say, one seems to have something to do with the other, even as it attempts an approximation of that "other" quality...so who knows how it all works? Maybe that's part of an unfolding..

or maybe none of it goes like that at all? it just the way we think of it or?
 

I don't know how to define it, but it seems like the difference between a fading dusk during an indian summer in the actaul, and say, the buena vista tone set or something?

Then again, there's a weird quality to all of that too...

but in an interest in that sense of caring for the organic? Do we hesitate in equating it all too much? Should we?
 

One does feel personally motivated to qualify, before one makes the hasty assumption, generally implied as, probably, a faulty mis-application, of whatever that was I was just trying to get at...

Another one might not be able to define, but can still tell the difference with..

whoa, take hurricanes for example..

if there is a god? then god must be nicer than humans in some ways..because if you think about it..

in regards to hurricanes..the people that live in the areas have a lot of advanced notice as to where it's going to happen...the signs are just exteremly visible and everybody has the exact particular info. (without trying to hard) and the opportunity to get away from it...

and we wouldn't say anyone's a coward..for knowing to get in the house...and do other than sit under a tree...when they can hear however many beats between the flash and the approaching lightning..

the things some sick individuals do at times..that they'll try and make a correlation with that at times..or seem to...

ah..that's really different...a lack of flashes and lack of beats a lack of advance on particulars..

a lack of organic unfolding..

If there is a god some might have that big question for the pearly gates: "why are their wars?"

But one wonders if there is a god, if god's reply (if god could speak would be)..that's my question for you...didn't I give you enough figs? or the opportunity to grow figs and lettuce if you worked together?

but maybe that was impossible..i don't know..maybe i'm wrong about all of it..

i'm unsure if there's a god the way we think of it..it'd be different than humanity the way we think of it..maybe..i dunno...

i dunno if this would all be the big whatever's dream..(something it thought up) it's fun to think of it as a dream..

i still now that if i don't eat lunch..i'll get hungry, though..
 

You have it backwards. The question is how can the subjective dream lead us to gas hoses?
 

Is that true though? If one considers the things that go through their minds, after hearing the question...(consdering premise)you might arrive at those type of statemetns as a response? Just an odd style of conversing?

Can either lead to either? Is it "leading.." Obviously, one could concieve on an idea (imagination of dream)..and then you have realization (thinking of a product, and then actaully making the product, i guess)...

What makes one have the daydreaming experience though? It seems to be a relevant note.

Sometimes, when somebody spends all of their time thinking about everyday things(windex...taking out the garbage etc..)...

the boredom will leave then with wanting "escape"..and if they have time after the chores and other things..maybe they'll daydream..

Some folks that work in landscaping, or other fields like...
might have studied a little bit of art in high school...

Maybe when learning about paints, and building frames...they had a dream to be an artists..when that didn't work out...they still had an interest in the practical, commercial applications of the craft side of things..so that lead to them working in home improvement...or maintenance?

That might be another answer..


Some of them, on the weekend, if there's time..though the theory of art seems like something other than what they'd ever apply to anything...might find considering that side of things (along with the way the frames are built..and the types of paints and brushes folks used...) to be interesting..

if they are succesful in the home improvement biz..whatever resentment they might have about not being the artist on display..might fade with the understanding..that they'll make as much money with a years work..as that artist would selling a few of the more interesting ones (though it seems like a more boring life)...

even some of the less succesful ones, might have a less romatic view of medium..and still appreciate the creative folks (bully for them eh?)...

other commerical artist types..

that might be lost on the theory completely and some of them might have resentments..some of them might just roll their eyes..and some of them might have the attitude that it's all lost on them..but they know that they style wouldn't really sell as a look for houses...so they'll make more money than those characters in the long run..

some might scoff...and argue that they could do that..some of them actually could mimic the work...

others might come up with something more like bly's infamous attempt at imitating ginsberg...it's kind of like that..

but there's sort of less dimension to the imitation that the original..so nah, they can't really do that...

(bly's imitation was still funny though..and bly does have some great poems of his own...)...


some of the really scoffer types might argue that the creative work just looks like what a lot of art students all over the country were doing with their primer sets a few years ago...

some of them, though most of their life is spent in the commercial realm, might know where the techniques were derived from...


some of those worker types get crazy sometimes..as they age..some go crazy from boredom and don't come back..other get a little crazy but go back to normal and might have just been playing...

many of them stay calm and rational though..

it's that kind of gig...actaully the folks that work in those industries tend to be really safety conscious and reamain clear and calm while they work...

maybe on the weekends, they'll play in a band..or go to a show and drink a little tequila and watch the lights blur a little (that version of dreaming)...

maybe some of them will sit down and put the pen to paper and record some thoughts..

weirdly, enough, having working in low paying day jobs..some of the places have porn out on the work table..

but other establishments...the people that work there sometimes are nice..and have less morbid imaginations than some of the "crazy" works by the early 20th century artists that argued for the working class...

most of the folks in the warehouse gig are trying to get promoted actually..leave the music to the younger folks..they don't listen to it as much...

contrary to popular belief, a lot of the people in the food service industry are attached to their jobs...the truckers can smell if there's something wrong..and some of those places are greaser..but a lot of them kind of have to keep the sink clean...or the manager would fire them..because they can't afford the law suits...
 

most of the working class with jobs of that sort, might not have time to work on the creative end as much though?

In terms of consuming, if they aren't realted to them, or if it isn't somebody from their community or that they work with, and they don't make any money off of the thing...unless its something somebody close to them wants to be involved with..

they'd rather save their money (and need to)?

Usually they put some money in the plate at church (whatever their religeon might be)...some donate to charities (even if they don't have much money)...and are involved in positive community outreaches otherwise whatever their pre-cepts?

Even some of lower income folks (though some of those folks might make more money at their commercial trade than a poet teaching a workshop would...)...

things like amnesty...

maybe they like some of the bands from the region...or some of the songs they hear on the radio when they are working...

they always like to check out the murals at the civic center..

and then..some enjoy watching those old lamplit movies on the set..they can appreciate the jokes..but then the notice the way the set's built, and guess and how the lamps were set to get the light like that?...

Probably there are a lot of folks in that category of the world that..they don't really have a chance at that field..and they need to save..so they don't really bother getting into it that much?

Ah, maybe there's that crazy spastic kid who they wonder is a little bit off..but sometimes they get some of those jokes or something..and ah, that person's funny...


i think back in the day...reading books from the time..there were workers that would understand the content in poems and novels (and european countries are like that)..

they still might not want to spend their money on it though...
 

It depends on the type..some folks in the warehouses (I guess I've spent two or three summers working in a warehouse type enviroment...)..

they like the loud metal music..and just seem to have really purile and filthy senses of humors and minds..

though more toward the upper middle class, and having been to a private school...(which was a financial strain in some ways at the time)...

i don't know..maybe it was more of an odd taste if the arts..that..

ah..the financial investment job seemed boring..the air in the call centers was too recycled..i was too out of it to go back for the education certificate to teach (tending to have a car bill or whatever whenever i'd finally get enough money saved up...to have a savings..much less press a disc or record anything..but who cares..the music biz is too much sleaze and the work that would be realesed would be awful..and you'd probably just meet resistance..and mindless resistance either way..)...

at least i could daydream a little bit at the other dayjobs..

one wishes they had more money..and it gets lonsome being single..but you can occupy yourself with writing or whatever..

and sometimes they folks at the bar will like a song..you can also earn enough money to go out to dinner or get a free beer or pizza at the bar if they like the sound..

i quit gigging though..it just all seemed boring..

i would say even after being in that envirmoment..in contrast to the one i grew up on..where you wouldn't ever find any porn out on the table at work..and the people were calm and mild..

even after working in the warehouse..or in maintenance..

i'd still rather listen to mozart or some mellow chill tunes..some of the mellow kd lang albums with the artful touches and then those weird untillegible ambient bands (some of those weird bands were actually other than the really snobby ones...though whoa...some rich folks are really sweet and cool..they'll make donations to the local civic centers and charities..though i'm probably still more in the upper middle class..for being able to visit my relatives...overall)...

read something nice...

last think i'd want to do is listen to something that sounds like that old warehouse i used to work in...

nothing awful happened there or anything..just dull work at low pay...and that makes things complicated sometimes...

maybe i'm personalizing the response too much..but i think..
maybe that "character" can represent other arty types that end up in the lower income day jobs at some time in their lives...
 

Maybe I'm being discursive as a joke..


Maybe the answer is..you think up a look for a set...and then the technical knowledge helps with knowing how to cue or make a curtain and things like that?

Artists usually have a capacity for both. Some can do it all themselves, other consolidate the roles, so there will be more jobs?

Some can't find anyone else to help with the thing and they end up playing bass on the recording, too?

As you get older, art starts to seem like a waste of time, or like something that would only be turned into something awful though..

that's kidn of why i write less and sort of almost have given up on music..

(that is the truth and it seems to be in the terms of "self" but i hope the posters and editor understand i'm obvioulsy representing particular social types with that...duh..)
 

obviously..

of course, not everyone that listens to metal is "purile"...and one could argue you could see what would make them that way..but ah..

another thing about classical music is that the discs are cheaper...the phillips series has the disc at about 10 dollars a disc..

not that the enviroment doesn't already have enough discs to contend with (at least play them and keep it out of the dirt right?)..maybe more discs than anyone could buy...

similar problem with film materials..

paper is cheap bio-degradable and..replenishable..

the weird psychology of the discs being cheaper as opposed to say a hip hop disc costing about 18 dollars....

is that the neighborhood's into hip hop (probably sampling the thing)...have less money to spend on albums..

than the stereotype of the classical music type (though in the real world..all sorts of people from different classes listen to some of that..if they are into music at all...)...

i guess part of the reason it's cheaper is you would be looking at less of a royalties pay out..on the people that are already departed...

weird that it's considered an uppity thing..

when a lot of those composers..kind of starved while they were living...
 

how can you get around it being harsh souding..and doesn't really seem like a wise decision if you live in a noisey environment to be honest (more than a few of the people that work in that enviroment would know that..even the folks that don't work in warehouses and that listen to metal know that too though...they just stay back from the speakers and listen to other things sometimes..duh...)...


lately i've been enjoying just listening to the breeze...

i'm kind of the same way about metal as i am about carnivorism ( i try to have a diet more toward the veggies myself..)...

you know when you look over at the tin box full of whatever that is..

"look at that? how can you want to eat that?"

I don't know, i try to be other than a snob, but it just all seems really gross..and a really bad idea.